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	<title>Comments on: &#8220;Dragging the Shutter&#8221; revisited</title>
	<atom:link href="http://planetneil.com/tangents/2008/02/29/dragging-the-shutter-revisited/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://planetneil.com/tangents/2008/02/29/dragging-the-shutter-revisited/</link>
	<description>various writings on photography, whether techniques, ideas, equipment info, or just rants.</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 25 Jul 2008 12:43:14 +0000</pubDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.5.1</generator>
		<item>
		<title>By: Neil</title>
		<link>http://planetneil.com/tangents/2008/02/29/dragging-the-shutter-revisited/#comment-1558</link>
		<dc:creator>Neil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Jul 2008 21:15:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://planetneil.com/tangents/2008/02/29/dragging-the-shutter-revisited/#comment-1558</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Eli ..

You're correct in how the shutter speed and aperture and ISO settings interlock.  But this isn't quite what is meant by 'dragging the shutter'. 

Flash exposure is not affected by shutter speed (while you remain below max sync speed.)  This implies that if you have correct flash exposure (whether manual flash or TTL flash), then you can use pretty much any shutter speed, and your flash exposure will remain the same.  Ambient exposure though, will change and at some point become more dominant.  Or even add so much to the overall exposure, that you have over-exposure. 

Now, with most cameras, when you set it to one of the auto exposure modes, and switch your flash on, the camera will default to a specific shutter speed.  (Usually 1/60th or 1/125th, or thereabouts.)  Similarly with film cameras, many photographers set the camera to the suggested sync speed (which was also 1/60th or 1/90th or 1/125th or 1/250th, depending on the camera).  Which meant that in low-light conditions, the ambient light would be way under.  But the overall exposure would be correct because the flash exposure would be corret.  However, in this case, the background would be black, and there would be very little trace of the available light to give some of the mood of the place, or some kind of context to the photo.

So the technique then was to 'drag the shutter'.  To use a shutter speed lower than the suggested sync speed, and in this way allow the ambient light to register.

This method was particularly the way how film shooters would do it when they used manual flash.  Since the ISO was determined by the film speed used, and the aperture was pre-determined by the manual flash's output ... the easiest way to allow more ambient light in, was to use a slower shutter speed.

Now, what the gist of this article above is all about, is that as digital photographers, we don't need to be locked into the 'old school' way of doing it and only change our shutter speed to bring in more available light when using TTL flash.  We can just as easily change our aperture or ISO ... and our camera will follow our settings and let the (TTL controlled) flash give more light, or less light as we change our aperture and/or ISO settings.

Neil vN&lt;/blockquote&gt;

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Eli ..</p>
<p>You&#8217;re correct in how the shutter speed and aperture and ISO settings interlock.  But this isn&#8217;t quite what is meant by &#8216;dragging the shutter&#8217;. </p>
<p>Flash exposure is not affected by shutter speed (while you remain below max sync speed.)  This implies that if you have correct flash exposure (whether manual flash or TTL flash), then you can use pretty much any shutter speed, and your flash exposure will remain the same.  Ambient exposure though, will change and at some point become more dominant.  Or even add so much to the overall exposure, that you have over-exposure. </p>
<p>Now, with most cameras, when you set it to one of the auto exposure modes, and switch your flash on, the camera will default to a specific shutter speed.  (Usually 1/60th or 1/125th, or thereabouts.)  Similarly with film cameras, many photographers set the camera to the suggested sync speed (which was also 1/60th or 1/90th or 1/125th or 1/250th, depending on the camera).  Which meant that in low-light conditions, the ambient light would be way under.  But the overall exposure would be correct because the flash exposure would be corret.  However, in this case, the background would be black, and there would be very little trace of the available light to give some of the mood of the place, or some kind of context to the photo.</p>
<p>So the technique then was to &#8216;drag the shutter&#8217;.  To use a shutter speed lower than the suggested sync speed, and in this way allow the ambient light to register.</p>
<p>This method was particularly the way how film shooters would do it when they used manual flash.  Since the ISO was determined by the film speed used, and the aperture was pre-determined by the manual flash&#8217;s output &#8230; the easiest way to allow more ambient light in, was to use a slower shutter speed.</p>
<p>Now, what the gist of this article above is all about, is that as digital photographers, we don&#8217;t need to be locked into the &#8216;old school&#8217; way of doing it and only change our shutter speed to bring in more available light when using TTL flash.  We can just as easily change our aperture or ISO &#8230; and our camera will follow our settings and let the (TTL controlled) flash give more light, or less light as we change our aperture and/or ISO settings.</p>
<p>Neil vN</p></blockquote>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Eli</title>
		<link>http://planetneil.com/tangents/2008/02/29/dragging-the-shutter-revisited/#comment-1550</link>
		<dc:creator>Eli</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Jul 2008 06:28:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://planetneil.com/tangents/2008/02/29/dragging-the-shutter-revisited/#comment-1550</guid>
		<description>Neil,

Aha!  I think I finally got it :-)

In the past, the sweet spot for my D200 in a dimly lit hall is ISO 400 - f2.8 - 1/30th.   I always "drag the shutter" to catch some ambient light.  Now if I need more speed, let's say @ 1/60th I have to bump my ISO to 800.  And if  I need more speed 1/125th I have to bump my ISO to 1600.  All these three settings should give me approximately the same results without overloading my flash.

I will definitely try this one out.  If it works, I'm no longer limited to 1/30th.   Thank you, thank you, and thank you!!!

Eli</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Neil,</p>
<p>Aha!  I think I finally got it <img src='http://planetneil.com/tangents/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>In the past, the sweet spot for my D200 in a dimly lit hall is ISO 400 - f2.8 - 1/30th.   I always &#8220;drag the shutter&#8221; to catch some ambient light.  Now if I need more speed, let&#8217;s say @ 1/60th I have to bump my ISO to 800.  And if  I need more speed 1/125th I have to bump my ISO to 1600.  All these three settings should give me approximately the same results without overloading my flash.</p>
<p>I will definitely try this one out.  If it works, I&#8217;m no longer limited to 1/30th.   Thank you, thank you, and thank you!!!</p>
<p>Eli</p>
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		<title>By: Neil</title>
		<link>http://planetneil.com/tangents/2008/02/29/dragging-the-shutter-revisited/#comment-1482</link>
		<dc:creator>Neil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 Jun 2008 16:56:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://planetneil.com/tangents/2008/02/29/dragging-the-shutter-revisited/#comment-1482</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;HI there Raphael ...

To work in manual exposure mode, you can use (and probably need to use) your camera's built-in meter.  As much as it is very useful to be able to guess the exposure for the ambient light correctly, it isn't necessary for that, for you to be able to shoot in manual exposure mode.

I don't quite agree that working in shutter priority will help you LEARN how this works. 

About the second part of your comment - it would appear you're confusing the basic controls of your camera - shutter speed and aperture.  

The flash fires at a much faster speed than 1/500th.  (or 1/60th).

The way you're assuming there that shutter priority will work doesn't take into account that you / I / most people have no idea how the exposure algorithms work in a camera's metering system.   So your camera might very well default to a specific aperture when it detects a flash when you are in shutter priority mode.

In other words, you're back to guessing what your camera is doing, and having to 'fight' it for control. 

Your best option is to shoot in manual exposure mode on your camera and learn from that how to control the light, whether you're using manual flash or TTL flash. 

Neil vN&lt;/blockquote&gt;

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>HI there Raphael &#8230;</p>
<p>To work in manual exposure mode, you can use (and probably need to use) your camera&#8217;s built-in meter.  As much as it is very useful to be able to guess the exposure for the ambient light correctly, it isn&#8217;t necessary for that, for you to be able to shoot in manual exposure mode.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t quite agree that working in shutter priority will help you LEARN how this works. </p>
<p>About the second part of your comment - it would appear you&#8217;re confusing the basic controls of your camera - shutter speed and aperture.  </p>
<p>The flash fires at a much faster speed than 1/500th.  (or 1/60th).</p>
<p>The way you&#8217;re assuming there that shutter priority will work doesn&#8217;t take into account that you / I / most people have no idea how the exposure algorithms work in a camera&#8217;s metering system.   So your camera might very well default to a specific aperture when it detects a flash when you are in shutter priority mode.</p>
<p>In other words, you&#8217;re back to guessing what your camera is doing, and having to &#8216;fight&#8217; it for control. </p>
<p>Your best option is to shoot in manual exposure mode on your camera and learn from that how to control the light, whether you&#8217;re using manual flash or TTL flash. </p>
<p>Neil vN</p></blockquote>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Raphael Freeman</title>
		<link>http://planetneil.com/tangents/2008/02/29/dragging-the-shutter-revisited/#comment-1385</link>
		<dc:creator>Raphael Freeman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 11:55:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://planetneil.com/tangents/2008/02/29/dragging-the-shutter-revisited/#comment-1385</guid>
		<description>So if I want to start to learn how it works, shutter priority will give me the effect that I want. I agree that working manually is the best way, but since I'm an amateur, it will be many months or years before I can look at a scene and say, "for the correct exposure, I need 1/60th at f/2.8". 

What you are basically saying is that the flash is going to fire at 1/500th (or is it 1/60th) of a second regardless as to what shutter speed I put on my camera. So when I'm firing my flash at the subject, it will take into account the sync speed of my flash and my aperture (and I guess my ISO), but my camera will still leave my aperture open for a longer time allowing my background to be illuminated more?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So if I want to start to learn how it works, shutter priority will give me the effect that I want. I agree that working manually is the best way, but since I&#8217;m an amateur, it will be many months or years before I can look at a scene and say, &#8220;for the correct exposure, I need 1/60th at f/2.8&#8243;. </p>
<p>What you are basically saying is that the flash is going to fire at 1/500th (or is it 1/60th) of a second regardless as to what shutter speed I put on my camera. So when I&#8217;m firing my flash at the subject, it will take into account the sync speed of my flash and my aperture (and I guess my ISO), but my camera will still leave my aperture open for a longer time allowing my background to be illuminated more?</p>
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		<title>By: Neil</title>
		<link>http://planetneil.com/tangents/2008/02/29/dragging-the-shutter-revisited/#comment-1376</link>
		<dc:creator>Neil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:38:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://planetneil.com/tangents/2008/02/29/dragging-the-shutter-revisited/#comment-1376</guid>
		<description>

&lt;blockquote&gt;Raphael .. not quite.

With flash photography where you use the flash as the main source of light, ie, where you will have correct exposure from the flash regardless of the ambient light ... the idea is then to 'drag the shutter' so that you allow more ambient light it. 

Exposure would still be correct, but you have more of the mood of the scene.  You retain more of the sense of place than if you only use flash. 

By using shutter priority and forcing a slow shutter speed, you'd get the same effect.  But personally I would still prefer controlling every setting. 

Re your white balance question ... &lt;a href="http://planetneil.com/tangents/2006/10/25/white-balance-settings-my-approach/" rel="nofollow"&gt;here is how I approach it&lt;/a&gt;.

Neil vN&lt;/blockquote&gt;

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Raphael .. not quite.</p>
<p>With flash photography where you use the flash as the main source of light, ie, where you will have correct exposure from the flash regardless of the ambient light &#8230; the idea is then to &#8216;drag the shutter&#8217; so that you allow more ambient light it. </p>
<p>Exposure would still be correct, but you have more of the mood of the scene.  You retain more of the sense of place than if you only use flash. </p>
<p>By using shutter priority and forcing a slow shutter speed, you&#8217;d get the same effect.  But personally I would still prefer controlling every setting. </p>
<p>Re your white balance question &#8230; <a href="http://planetneil.com/tangents/2006/10/25/white-balance-settings-my-approach/" rel="nofollow">here is how I approach it</a>.</p>
<p>Neil vN</p></blockquote>
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		<title>By: Raphael Freeman</title>
		<link>http://planetneil.com/tangents/2008/02/29/dragging-the-shutter-revisited/#comment-1375</link>
		<dc:creator>Raphael Freeman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 14:46:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://planetneil.com/tangents/2008/02/29/dragging-the-shutter-revisited/#comment-1375</guid>
		<description>and for my next question, how do i do my white balance with this technique? Normally I use a grey card with my flash, would this still work?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>and for my next question, how do i do my white balance with this technique? Normally I use a grey card with my flash, would this still work?</p>
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		<title>By: Raphael Freeman</title>
		<link>http://planetneil.com/tangents/2008/02/29/dragging-the-shutter-revisited/#comment-1374</link>
		<dc:creator>Raphael Freeman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 14:39:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://planetneil.com/tangents/2008/02/29/dragging-the-shutter-revisited/#comment-1374</guid>
		<description>So if I understand correctly from your invaluable pages, one way that I can achieve lighting up my background is by user shutter priority and selecting a shutterspeed lower than what I would have normally done (certainly lower than the camera’s default setting) and using TTL on my speedlight. Is this use of the shutter speed what you mean by “dragging the shutter?”</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So if I understand correctly from your invaluable pages, one way that I can achieve lighting up my background is by user shutter priority and selecting a shutterspeed lower than what I would have normally done (certainly lower than the camera’s default setting) and using TTL on my speedlight. Is this use of the shutter speed what you mean by “dragging the shutter?”</p>
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		<title>By: tiger darson</title>
		<link>http://planetneil.com/tangents/2008/02/29/dragging-the-shutter-revisited/#comment-1132</link>
		<dc:creator>tiger darson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 26 Apr 2008 06:12:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://planetneil.com/tangents/2008/02/29/dragging-the-shutter-revisited/#comment-1132</guid>
		<description>how about we call the technique "dragging exposure" from here on out?

(the term "dragging" not to be taken too literally, of course...)

and let me join everybody else in saying "thank you." even though i've only actually used it once so far, i'm nevertheless quite fond of and impressed with this technique (whatever you want to call it), and i appreciate your helping me to understand it better. that's a valuable insight, that it's not all about the shutter. that realization opens up all kinds of interesting possibilities.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>how about we call the technique &#8220;dragging exposure&#8221; from here on out?</p>
<p>(the term &#8220;dragging&#8221; not to be taken too literally, of course&#8230;)</p>
<p>and let me join everybody else in saying &#8220;thank you.&#8221; even though i&#8217;ve only actually used it once so far, i&#8217;m nevertheless quite fond of and impressed with this technique (whatever you want to call it), and i appreciate your helping me to understand it better. that&#8217;s a valuable insight, that it&#8217;s not all about the shutter. that realization opens up all kinds of interesting possibilities.</p>
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		<title>By: Alex foto</title>
		<link>http://planetneil.com/tangents/2008/02/29/dragging-the-shutter-revisited/#comment-1126</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex foto</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Apr 2008 15:42:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://planetneil.com/tangents/2008/02/29/dragging-the-shutter-revisited/#comment-1126</guid>
		<description>Hi Neil,

I can't get enough of this website and article. I am a newbee [do they call it?] on wedding photography and yet to cover a full-day wedding photography soon. And I can assure you that I would definitely dare try these techniques there, of course, after practicing it at home and somewhere else first.

I have been reading postings at Photo.net for the past 2 or 3 months now and pretty much everyone would mention your name when it comes to such issues. You are indeed a great asset to photography and photographers, so please keep up the good work! Thank you very very much!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Neil,</p>
<p>I can&#8217;t get enough of this website and article. I am a newbee [do they call it?] on wedding photography and yet to cover a full-day wedding photography soon. And I can assure you that I would definitely dare try these techniques there, of course, after practicing it at home and somewhere else first.</p>
<p>I have been reading postings at Photo.net for the past 2 or 3 months now and pretty much everyone would mention your name when it comes to such issues. You are indeed a great asset to photography and photographers, so please keep up the good work! Thank you very very much!</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Kathurima</title>
		<link>http://planetneil.com/tangents/2008/02/29/dragging-the-shutter-revisited/#comment-1024</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Kathurima</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Apr 2008 05:44:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://planetneil.com/tangents/2008/02/29/dragging-the-shutter-revisited/#comment-1024</guid>
		<description>Neil,
I first read your pages on shutter drag about 2 1/2 years  ago, while prepping for my first evening wedding shoot. I can safely say that the images I got on that day are still some of the very best wedding photos I have ever taken! I was using a Rebel G film camera with a generic flash, a Demb Flash Diffuser and ISO 200 and 400 colour neg film.  I now use an XTi (400D) with a 580EXII flash and the technicque comes in really 

This update just reconfirms to me that I gotta get me that 5D this year ;)

It didn't really register with me that I can actually maintain higher shutter speeds by keeping my ISO up and controlling the flash output manually. Duh! ;) I know that now ISO 1600 won't be a limitation on my future shutter-dragging escapades.

Incidentally, what fast wide prime would you recommend for Canon SLR?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Neil,<br />
I first read your pages on shutter drag about 2 1/2 years  ago, while prepping for my first evening wedding shoot. I can safely say that the images I got on that day are still some of the very best wedding photos I have ever taken! I was using a Rebel G film camera with a generic flash, a Demb Flash Diffuser and ISO 200 and 400 colour neg film.  I now use an XTi (400D) with a 580EXII flash and the technicque comes in really </p>
<p>This update just reconfirms to me that I gotta get me that 5D this year <img src='http://planetneil.com/tangents/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>It didn&#8217;t really register with me that I can actually maintain higher shutter speeds by keeping my ISO up and controlling the flash output manually. Duh! <img src='http://planetneil.com/tangents/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> I know that now ISO 1600 won&#8217;t be a limitation on my future shutter-dragging escapades.</p>
<p>Incidentally, what fast wide prime would you recommend for Canon SLR?</p>
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